Aaron Gustafson: "I'm really into the whole web standards thing"
January 16, 2008, Categories: Web design, CSS, Web standards
Aaron's designs are really amazing though he has never taken a computer class and he has no formal design training except of taking art classes as a child. Now Aaron Gustafson is a Principal at Easy! Designs. Before this he has worked as a freelancer through agencies like Aquent and as a full-time employee for an advertising agency. He has personally done work for Aetna, American Skandia, Deloitte & Touche, Dime bank, Gartner, Guinness, Scholastic, Spalding, and many others. Aaron also managed to be a journalist after having started a music magazine in college (the fritz) that eventually gained distribution across the US. In fact Aaron?s first web work was building a site for the fritz. Aaron has written several articles for online publications (A List Apart, Digital Web) and has contributed to 3 books. He has also spoken at numerous conferences including SXSW, Web Directions, and An Event Apart.
How did you get hooked on web design?
At the time, I was a journalist and publisher, intent on continuing down that road, but when I started building a website for the magazine I ran at the time, I was amazed by what power and control I had despite it being, what, 1996? I guess HTML just made sense to me and I decided that I wanted to work on the web. There weren't many formal training classes available, so I just taught myself as I read through this book? Creating & Enhancing Netscape Web Pages ? that I found in the bargain bin at CompUSA. Despite the corny title, it was a great book for jumping in and getting started. Sure, it was firmly grounded in the table-layout world, but that?s pretty much all there was back then. There are lots of great beginner titles now, of course, but back then they were few and far between.
You are specializing in web development using CSS, XHTML, JavaScript/DOM Scripting/Ajax and also web application development using PHP and MySQL. Which of these specialties is the most fascinating for you?
When I look at the list of things I do, I have to admit I chuckled a little bit when you used the term "specialize". There's so much to like about working on the web these days. I'm really into the whole web standards thing, of course, because I am just floored by how rich and meaningful we can make our markup. So I guess you could say I'm quite enamored of XHTML, but I also love the layout possibilities CSS brings to the table, especially in the realm of alternate media, like print.
My passion for JavaScript was a natural outgrowth of my love for semantics; I started playing with different ways of enhancing the page, building things like auto-generating page glossaries and, a bit later, my footnote links for printed pages, and, eventually, helper scripts for assisting designers in building maintainable grid layouts. On the back end, I?m still a big believer in PHP, despite liking other languages and dabbling in frameworks like Ruby on Rails.
I suppose, in the most general terms, my specialization is progressive enhancement, which touches on each of the facets of my work. Truly progressive interfaces rely on a firm foundation of (X)HTML and HTTP (used for links and forms). With that foundation in place, you add the CSS to enhance the experience, make it attractive, give it more visual hierarchy, and brand it. That can be accomplished in a layered way, delivering an enhanced experience to modern browsers and giving older/less capable ones styles they can handle, such as typographic and color treatments. The next layer is the JavaScript, which, when written properly, can be delivered in an a la carte basis to enhance the user?s experience.
Aaron, you?ve been reporting on different web design issues at numerous conferences including COMDEX, An Event Apart, SXSW, The Ajax Experience and MacWorld. What is the most important part for you at any conference? Is it sharing your personal experience, learning something new from your colleagues or making pleasant acquaintances with true professionals of web design industry?
I think the social aspect of conferences is very important. The web community is a very tight one, much more so than any other group of people in the industries I?ve been involved with?including the music and film worlds. We are, however, very spread out. And although we can keep in touch with each other via Twitter, IM, email, etc., it?s really no substitute for seeing each other face-to-face.
Sometimes that face-to-face interaction becomes a ?show and tell,? other times it devolves into debates about what is going on in our industry, and sometimes it?s just talking about our lives away from the computer. The people I've met in this industry, in particular, seem to actually care about each other and take an active interest in what?s going on in each others? lives. It's not just a facade; they genuinely care.
What are your recent projects and what are you going to devote your time and talent to in the nearest future?
In addition to my day-to-day consulting work, I've been spending quite a bit of time working with the folks on the Internet Explorer team at Microsoft. A little more than a year ago, I got involved with them through my work on the Web Standards Project and my involvement in the JavaScript Ninjas (a small group of highly-influential JS developers; the name is an homage to the CSS Samurai). The IE team was looking to the Ninjas and WaSP's DOM Scripting Task Force for a list of bugs that needed fixing and to get some direction as to what we would like to see in terms of enhancements to their JScript (IE's native JavaScript implementation) engine.
I somehow fell into an unofficial role as spokesperson for the two groups in our discussions with Microsoft and from there, I became involved with helping the IE team figure out a way to meet the needs of standards-aware developers without breaking sites that relied on IE?s flawed CSS implementation.
It was very eye-opening for me to become involved with Microsoft in this way because, like so many standards advocates out there, I loved to hate Internet Explorer 6 and I couldn't help but feel a little ill will toward the people who made it, if only for letting it stagnate for so long. When I got involved in the team?s work on IE8, IE7 had pretty much just come out of beta, but despite its improvements in terms of CSS support, I still wasn't sold on Microsoft's commitment to standards.
The truth, though, is that there are a lot of people within Microsoft who do get standards and who feel our pain and I?m very excited that IE8 has a completely rewritten rendering engine capable of delivering the kind of high-quality CSS support so many of us have been yearning for from them.
So that's been a lot of my free time, but I also managed to put together a little mobile app for myself, Tipr (tipr.mobi), which was quite an interesting undertaking (and is probably a conversation unto itself). Mobile is a very different beast and it was particularly, er, fun to attempt to execute something as simple as a tipping application in a way that was accessible to a myriad of mobile browsers. Once I got that fairly well sorted, I set my sites on offering the Tipr service via text message as well. I started by integrating it with Twitter (as a Twitterbot), which was a challenge, and just recently opened the service up to everyone via TextMarks.
As for what the future will hold? I?m not sure yet. I am interested in seeing WaSP get involved in the CMS and content tools arena and have talked with the powers that be about transitioning to that after my work with IE8 comes to a close, which should be soon. I also have a few applications I?d like to build. Some are just fun things I?d want to use, but some, I think, could turn into powerful tools for other people and could eventually make some money. We?ll see if I ever have time to make them a reality.
You?ve got a number of honors like Connecticut Art Directors Club Award, WebAwards, American Design Awards. Which of them is the most memorable for you and why?
Honestly, I have mixed feelings about award shows (which is probably uncharacteristic for a long-time judge of the WebAward competition). I love seeing great work get rewarded, but I don?t frequently see that happen. So few competitions take code into account and, to me, that?s the real test of a site?s quality. Truly great sites are well-designed, yes, but they also need to meet the needs of their users, provide a great experience, and be maintainable. Sadly, those last three components are often lost in competitions where the judges are easily won over by slick Flash animation and TV-like 'interactivity'. Actually, that may be why I?ve continued to judge the WebAward competition for so many years: to provide a counter-balance to the superficial judgment of website quality.
Of course, leave it to me to make this a diatribe against award competitions?but to answer your question, the only one that truly mattered to me was actually not an award I won, but the fact that a site I built, ride4ever.org, was a finalist in the SXSW Web Awards back in 2005. The reason it meant something was because it was in the CSS category, which meant the judges were paying attention to my code. Being a finalist was something of a validation of all of the hard work I had been putting in on the standards front while quietly toiling away at my desk. It was long before I really knew anyone else in the movement as anything other than names.
In one of his articles Peter-Paul Koch has mentioned that JavaScript is worthless without DOM. What do you think on this?
I haven?t read the article, but I imagine his argument went something like this: you can do a lot with JavaScript, but until you start interacting with the document, you really can?t do much of value, and I'd agree with that. That said, JavaScript has been in use (albeit to a far less extent) on the server side since 1996 and it?s found its way into several desktop applications, including Photoshop, as well. I think the future will see JavaScript come into its own outside of the browser.
Aaron, will you please tell us what your responsibilities as a Technical Editor for A List Apart are? How did you make your way to this position? What does it take to be a technical editor at A List Apart?
A List Apart is very much a collaborative effort. We all weigh-in on submissions and decide if they?re a fit for us. When the articles are particularly technical, it falls on the tech editing team (which now includes Ethan Marcotte and, on occasion, Dan Mall as well) to determine: a) if the submission is right for our audience and b) if the author has done all of the necessary work to make it ready to share with the world through our magazine. We often have suggestions for the author to take into consideration before we will run an article.
As for how I found myself in this position?well, I had met Jeffrey Zeldman a few times and mentioned how much I love the magazine and how I?d be willing to offer my services should he need some help. Knowing of my prior editing and writing experience, Jeffrey brought me on to help out on the copy editing front. Over time, the group started relying on me more and more for technical editing and I was transitioned officially into a Technical Editor role.
It's stated on the Easy! Designs homepage that its employees are famous designers, developers, and architects from all over the world. How do you find the people to work with and what features and skills should a person possess in order to become a co-worker at easy-designs.net?
Easy! Designs, despite being led by me, is very much a cooperative. Of course, I play a major role in most, if not all projects, but I am always looking for great folks to collaborate with. Since I began working full-time on Easy! back in 2006, we've enlisted the help of some of the top names in the industry for specific projects; they've included Andy Clarke, Mark Boulton, Rob Weychert, and Cindy Li, just to name a few. Some contribute to Easy! more regularly than others. Craig Cook, Michael Hessling, and Jenifer Hanen have also done a lot of work with us on the production end. Kelly McCarthy, our resident whip-cracker/project manager (also my wife and business partner), keeps us all on spec and makes sure our finances are in order so everyone gets paid on time. We?ve got a great pool of talent to draw on.
Each person involved in Easy! is someone that I?ve met in my travels or know by reputation. When I meet someone with talent and drive, I file them away in the back of my mind until we are working on a project that would be a good fit for them. They don't have to be famous, in fact the term I believe I used on our site is "well-known", but each has either already contributed to the web community as a whole or has the potential to.
Being the founder and principal at Easy! you probably have ideas on its future. Will you please share them with us?
I have a general vision for Easy!, but you never know what the future holds. I?d like to see Easy! grow steadily over the next few years, putting us in a position where I can hire some of the talented freelancers that work for us as either full- or, at least, part-time staff. I?m not hoping for growth for growth?s sake, I think it will happen organically and I don?t want to see the team get too large?just big enough for us to be able to tackle the kinds of projects we want to do.
Our current schedule has us continuing to do a good deal of client work, including building a few really neat applications/services in the near term. We've been doing quite a few sites in Expression Engine, which I see continuing as we've been quite happy with it as a tool. I can also see us setting aside some time to build a few of the applications I've been thinking about lately, but how soon that will be is anyone?s guess.
Aaron, will you please tell me what it is like to be the member of the Web Standards Project?
WaSP is a fantastic organization with a great mission, but it takes a good deal of time and commitment. It's a completely volunteer organization too, so it is the sort of thing that you need to make time for. Obviously, I think the work we do is worth the investment of my personal time, but I?m also practical about what I commit to doing as a member of WaSP. As with any volunteer organization, it's important to give yourself something specific to do without biting off more than you can chew. That's why I've been focusing on our work with Microsoft on IE8 for the last few months. Sure, I've also been tracking developments with Mobile Safari via the WaSP Buzz Blog, but I decided I needed to "clear the decks", so to speak, and focus primarily on something I felt had the greatest opportunity for furthering WaSP's agenda. When you?re as busy as most of us are, you need that sort of focus.
Can you speak about your experience as a contributing author to Web Design in a Nutshell (3rd Edition), Pro DOM Scripting with Ajax, APIs and Libraries, AdvancED DOM Scripting: Dynamic Web Design Techniques?
I love to write and come from a journalism background, so it seemed natural for me to begin writing about the web. I wrote my first article for A List Apart back in 2004 and loved it. It?s a lot like the professional training that I do, but obviously needs to be a little more targeted in terms of content.
Being a contributor to a book definitely has its perks: you aren't on the hook for 200 or more pages and you can focus on just one small facet of whatever the book is about. Sure, the money?s not as good, but you still get the same sense of accomplishment and satisfaction looking at the final published work, knowing you had a hand in its creation. And, in many cases, you still get royalties, which is nice.
I'm sure the future will see a few books that are solely my creation, but I do enjoy collaborating with other folks. Jen Robbins (Web Design in a Nutshell) was amazing to work with and getting to work with [Jonathan] Snook, Stuart [Langridge], and Dan [Webb] on Pro DOM Scripting well, what can I say That was an all-star team.
When it all boils down to it though, the article and book stuff is a way for me to share my knowledge with others. It?s not about showing off some cool technique, but rather showing how you can use simple, discrete steps to piece together something really impressive. It?s just another avenue for educating others in the field, which is something I thoroughly enjoy.
Do you prefer writing books on web design, consulting the beginners or creating design products yourself? Why?
I think if I had my druthers, I?d probably balance my work schedule with a little bit of each. I love educating and my writing, public speaking, and corporate training all scratch that itch. But I never want to be solely an educator because I don?t want my knowledge to become too academic, I want it to be practical, informed by being in the trenches, slogging through lines of CSS or JavaScript or XHTML with everyone else. I think if you lose that, you risk becoming irrelevant or, at least, out of touch.
What web design blogs/sites/magazines would you advice to read to the beginners and also professionals of web design to enrich their knowledge?
ALA is always my first recommendation because it has taught me a lot over the years; we just have so many amazing resources in there. Digital Web is another great resource for beginners and seasoned professionals and I think Vitamin certainly has some excellent content as well. On the print end of things, I highly recommend Jen Robbins? Learning Web Design for beginners. The third edition of that book, which just came out this year, shows you what to do, from start to finish in a very practical way. It?s especially good for folks coming from a design background who may be intimidated by code. As for more advanced topics, I?ve really enjoyed both of Jeremy Keith?s books, and Andy Clarke?s Transcending CSS.
I enjoyed reading your interview Jeremy Keith published in Digital Web Magazine. You seem to be a very good interviewer and I wonder what the question you?d like to ask yourself is. And of course what will be the answer to this question?
Yeah, it was fun interviewing Jeremy. First off, he?s a great guy, but it was also nice because it was like a trip down memory lane for me. Back in my journalist days, I was interviewing everyone from Tori Amos to Russ Meyer, so it was nice to play with that format in the technical realm. Obviously reading people?s articles, books, and blog posts is nice, but it's no substitute for the more conversational style of an interview. Plus, he's in a band too "Salter Cane" so it was a little like coming full-circle for me as a journalist.
Now what would I ask myself? Hmm... that's a tough one; it's not something I've thought a lot about. I guess sometimes I wonder how it is that I got to where I am today. The fact that I?ve contributed to so many books, been invited to speak as far away as Australia, and am fortunate enough to be able to run my own company and still pay my bills amazes me. So I guess the question would be something along the lines of ?How does someone get to where you are in the web world?? The answer, though it sounds stupid and pat, is simply this: setting goals and working hard to attain those goals. Most of the time, it's not possible to reach those goals on your own and you need to look to others for assistance. Molly Holzschlag, Jeffrey Zeldman, and Lane Becker, in my case, have all been very instrumental in helping me get to where I am today. And I think the best way I can demonstrate my appreciation and eternal thanks to them (apart from the obvious) is to "pay it forward" and give other people the help they need to do what I do. In most cases, all they need is a little encouragement or the right introduction. It?s a mission I take very seriously, which is probably why I am so committed to the educational aspects of my work.
What is the most challenging in your profession and what is most rewarding?
Managing clients can certainly be a challenge and it?s often much more difficult than architecting an application; people are far more complicated than machines. And being that, for the most part, we work remotely from our clients, there?s always the possibility that something you say via email or on Basecamp can be misinterpreted and lead to work not getting done (or not done correctly) or - in the worst cases - it can actually lead to interpersonal issues between a client and a member of your staff, etc. Diplomacy in written communications is key to making everything run smoothly, which is why I tend to read and re-read anything I write before posting it to a client.
The most rewarding aspects of my work are really two-fold: first, the joy of sitting back and looking at the final result of a project we really worked hard on; second, seeing the light bulbs go off over people?s heads as you?re giving a presentation or are talking to them afterward. Both make me very happy.
Aaron, it was a great pleasure to hear your answers. Thanks.







